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Do you drive a Ford P71?
Yes 35%  35%  [ 9 ]
No 65%  65%  [ 17 ]
Total votes : 26
 
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 Post Posted: Fri 30 Apr 2004 22:58 
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Location: Orange County, California, USA
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The idea of having a Police Unit (look alike) may have it's place but it also can cause many problems. It is probably best if you drive a non-descript vehicle.

For instance, I use a 1997 Ford Taurus Gold with tan clothe interior. I am not mistaken for a police unit. I blend into almost any neighborhood.

Further, I do not have any distinctive markings or light packages on the vehicle.

I had a former partner when I was in California, that didn't agree with my using "Family Cars" After I moved, he went out and purchased former units from auctions. Then suited them up with the complete package. Wig-Wags, rear deck and grill mounted lights, camera, consoul mounted laptops, and more... Ridiculous. Not three months later he was arrested for impersonating a Police vehicle. Ouch... I tried to tell him.

Anyway, whatever you do please use it wisely. We are in the business to catch those that don't want to be caught. Don't go around waving a sign.

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 Post subject: Interesting
 Post Posted: Sun 02 May 2004 10:36 
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Location: Tracy, California
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I see that the debate continues. :?

It is important to take into considerations that BEAs work throughout the country--where it is legal--and that not every single place bears the exact same way of doing things.

Mention of a person getting arrested in California for impersonating a police officer may be considered disingenuous absent including other factors that would lead one to being arrested for this offense.

What exactly was the example person doing?

How was he/she dressed?

What color, if any, were the deck lights and were these lights a factor?

Did he/she use credentials that would lead one to reasonably believe that he/she was a cop?

Was his/her car marked? If so, with what?

These are important factors to consider in support of listing an incident to support a view or opinion.

For example, a BEA was arrested for impersonating a cop because he was pulling people over with a blue light. He got what he deserved.

In California, it is permissable to use Amber deck lights in certain circumstances, and it is even okay to display red steady burning or red flashing lights when a hazardous situation is at hand. CVC25269

There are certain pieces of equipment that fall under the safety catagory. Prisoner partitions are self-explanatory. Extra warning lights work when there is no parking and a quick approach is necessary. My dashcam has destroyed allegations after rewind and play have been put into action, and the video captured by the dashcam at night will not come out if spotlights aren't used to light the stage.

Am I to discontinue the use of the aforementioned safety equipment and liability protection equipment in favor of preserving someone's fragile sensibilties? I think not.

Of course I will concede that use of police-like vehicles is a liabililty if the user is irresponsible, and it is worth mentioning that cops in my area use the Ford Taures for marked and unmarked police work. In fact, the Chevy Impala, Ford Expedition, Chevy Camaro, Chevy Blazer (the small SUV?) Dodge Trucks, Dodge SUVs, assorted vans and etceteras are all used for police work. Does this mean that all these vehicles should be avoided for BEA work?

The key is to study and follow the applicable laws in one's area of operation. It is unreasonable to take the position that this is how we do it here, so this is how it should be done in the United States when there is no uniform code to follow for a specific element of the trade.

While appreciate all counter views, a good counter-point bears roots in common sense, rule of law, logic and history; indeed, amiguous anecdotes leave much to question.

Rex


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sun 02 May 2004 11:23 
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I apologize if my previous post was ambiguous.

How I conduct my business probably bears striking difference to the manner in which you conduct yours. I am often in a surveilence mode. I drive through and round neighborhoods, as well as sit and watch. Having a vehicle that draws attention is not what I need. I use the "family car" because it fits in with almost any surrounding and for the most part goes unnoticed.

My former partner who was also formerly in law enforcement, used the vehicles to portray an air of "Police Like" presence. I am not certain of his reasoning, other than he must of missed being on the dept.

For clarity purposes, he had "legal" equipment installed on the vehicle. Red & amber lights. However, he had these set up with flashing headlights and tail-lights (wig-wags) Upon his arrest, I know that he was dressed in all black with Bail Enforcement in gold lettering on the shirt front and back. He was in the process of detaining a 'skip' when he was apprehended. Both were taken into custody. The fugitve for bail violation. And him for operating a vehicle that could be mistaken for the police. He was fined and had to remove said equipment from his vehicle. BTW - he did get paid for the apprehension of his 'skip' :)

I was just providing my input and did not mean to offend or upset anyone with my remarks.

Thank you,

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 Post subject: p-71
 Post Posted: Sun 02 May 2004 12:43 
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AGAIN IT IS UP TO THE BEA ON VEHICLE US BUT YOU HAVE TO CONSIDER THE WAY ITS BEING USED.I USE A DODGE DAKOTA PICK UP WITH A CAP(IT HAS TAIL LITE FLASHERS AND HEADLITE FLASHERS FOR WHEN I CANNOT PARK AND NEED TO LEAVE UNIT ALONG THE ROAD)I ALSO HAVE AT MY DISPOSALE A 500+ HORSEPOWER BLACK FORD LIGHTNING(SUPER HIGH PERFORMANCE TRUCK 3RD FASTEST AMERICAN PRODUCTION VEHICLE)A BUICK CENTURY A JEEP GRAND CHEROKEE PLUS OTHER UNITS EACH HAS A EQUIPMENT BAG WITH ALL NEEDED STUFF(FIRST AID KIT, SPARE CUFFS ,SPARE AMMO, CHANGE OF CLOTHES,HIDDEN CASH FOR EMERGENCIES ETC) PLUS OTHER GOODIES.I ALSO HAVE A GMC CONVERSION VAN FOR LONG DISTANCE TRANSPORT AND SURVAILENCE WORK.THE VAN HAS SOME CHANGES TO MAKE IT WORK BETTER(I HAVE AN INFERED CAMERA(FROM A WRECKED SEARCH AND RESCUE VAN)AND MONITOR ALSO A LAP TOP WITH GPS TO SHOW ALL MAPS AND LOCATION-ALSO A FLEETBOSS SAT SYSTEM SO MY OFFICE CAN CHECK MY LOCATION AT ANYTIME ON THE INTERNET AND SINCE I CHARGE TRANSPORT BY THE LOADED MILE I CAN DOWNLOAD MY ROUTE AND INVOICE TO THE NEAREST ONE TENTH OF A MILE AND INCLUDE IT WITH MY INVOICE.

AGAIN P-71 CRN VICS HAVE THEIR PLACE IN SOME OF OUR OPERATIONS-THEY JUST DO NOT WORK IN MINE SO I DO NOT US THEM.EACH ONE OF US DEVELOPS OUR OWN STYLE AND WE KNOW WHAT WORKS FOR US AND WHAT DOES NOT-WHAT IS MOST IMPORTANT IS DO NOT GIVE THE MEDIA A CHANCE TO LABEL US CRIMINALS AND WANABEES


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 Post subject: CrwnVics
 Post Posted: Sun 02 May 2004 21:51 
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Re: The Arrest for Impersonation

It sounds like the arrest may have occurred subsequent to a BEA car stop--a major, major no no--and/or with flashing lights--another bad way to do things.

I agree that the CV is, for all intents and purposes, useless for surveillance work, but the CV is a real plus if one ever finds his or herself checking addresses in..let's say...the 14th Street area in Oakland California or other neighborhoods where a slow moving vehicle may very well be considered a Drive-by shooting in the works by the local shooters.

It is also worth mentioning that California law requires checking in with the agency holding jurisdiction over a given target location. It is my S.O.P to physically visit the agency where a patrol supervisor or shift commander is briefed on all details and supplied with copies of all applicable documents to the bail arrest. This allows a given agency to meet with us, check our credentials, documentation, and choice of transporation. By doing this, I have never had a problem when attempting a bail arrest when using a CV.

My approach to bail bond contract enforcement is very proactive. In fact, I think that I've logged maybe 12 hours of surveillance in 12 years, so yes, people do things differently with no method standing out.

I would like to close by extending my sincere appreciation to Admin for addressing this discussion in such a way that the outcome is productive and well worth an audience.

Rex


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Mon 03 May 2004 16:41 
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WOW! I never imagined the response I would get to this question! :D I conclude that everyone has a different way of doing this job, hopefully everyone that is doing the job is operating within the law and not bringing the industry any negative publicity.


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 Post subject: p-71
 Post Posted: Mon 10 May 2004 04:37 
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LITTLE OFF BASE BUT STILL GOOD-I MADE AN ARREST THIS WEEKEND AND A RELATIVE OF THE SKIP CALLED THE LOCAL PD WHEN I PUT HIM IN MY TRUCK-THE LOCAL PD DISPATCHER CONFIRMED THAT I WAS A BEA AND LICENSED BY THE STATE BUT SHE STILL INSISTED A OFFICER RESPOND-THE CHIEF CAME HIMSELF AND SHE INSISTED I BE ARRESTED FOR KIDNAPPING THE CHIEF READ HER THE RIOT ACT AND TOLD HER WE HAVE MORE POWER THEM THE PD AT TIMES SHE STILL INSISTED ON SIGNING A COMPLAINT- AS SOON AS SHE SIGNED THE CHIEF ARRESTED HER FOR FILING A FALSE REPORT-ALL OS THIS PROBALY WOULD NOT HAVE HAPPENED IF I PUT THE SKIP INTO A P-71.
ALSO A P-71 TENDS TO GET MORE LEWAY ON V&T LAW WHEN TRANSPORTING-AS WE HAVE BEEN SAYING PRO AND CON DECIDE FOR YOUSELF AND DO IT RIGHT


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sun 13 Jun 2004 18:27 
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Police look-alike cars are not for BEA work no matter what pros there are in using them; the cons far outweigh the pros (no pun intended). Period.

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Lance Allen Wilkinson
Recoveries by L.A.W.
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“What is sought is found... what is overlooked escapes” (Oedipus Rex)


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue 17 Aug 2004 09:02 
 
I can understand not wanting to be spotted. On the other hand, dosn't it make sense to have a vehicle that *would* make you stand out when you're in an area, simply to prevent the locals from calling the Real Cops™ ?

The impersonation aspect is concerning. I live in VA and intend to acquire a 2004 P71, complete with grill guard, cage, laptop stand, amber/red LED's (to prevent them from reflecting any color whatsoever to prevent being mistaken for an emergency vehicle). Does anyone see a problem with this from a legal standpoint? I suppose I should ask my attorney, but any input from the community here is appreciated.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue 17 Aug 2004 09:02 
 
I should clarify, I would never use a P71 for surveillance.


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