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9's, .40's and .45's ..Oh My
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Author:  infamousenforcer45 [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 08:40 ]
Post subject:  9's, .40's and .45's ..Oh My
Which do you prefer and why?My personal choice is the 45 and I own a few different ones.To me it's more bang for the buck!
Author:  DSI [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 09:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
I have responded with this same answer many times here on FRN "One that works when you need it, that is the one I perfer". May I suggest that you use the search button, where you will find several posts on this same issue.
Author:  SpanielPI [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 09:58 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
Thank you for the question..... :lol:

However, there is alot of information available through the "search" function regarding this topic. This is 1 of those undying ones that always resurfaces.

My personal opinon/preferences:

Re: 9mm's: STAY AWAY FROM THESE...PERIOD.

There are far too many documented instances from both the Law Enforcement and Military communities of 9mm failures, stovepiping, jamming, and not stopping the aggressor. There are also documented instances, from hospitals and police reports, of criminals shooting each other with 9mm's, multiple times, and the victim, albeit another criminal, surviving.
There have also been documented cases of 9mm bullets literally "bouncing" off of vehicles. They just simply do not have enough knock down or penetration power.

The whole objective in shooting someone or something is to KILL them or it. 9mm's just don't get the job done.
Because of the multiple negative issues associated with 9mm's, alot of Soldiers and Cops carry .45's they have purchased themselves.

1 thing to consider: A .380, .38, and 9mm are all basically the same size shell casing...very close diameters. The difference lies in the grain loads, actual type of bullet, etc. For example, a .38+p jhp is far more lethal and powerful than a standard 9mm fmj bullet.

I currently carry a Ruger LCP .380 in an ankle holster or small of the back as a back up; A Taurus Pro Millenium 145 .45 with 3- 12 rd hi-cap mags. If the threat level of my target is extremely high...murderer, previous weapons charges, etc. I will even carry my Keltec PLR 5.56 mm w/90 rd drum.

But again, please bear in mind: It is not our function to cause injury or death to anyone. Rather it is our responsibility and mission to safely and legally exonerate our client's liability and bond as low key, quietly, and non-threatening a manner as possible.

We have to be trained enough, confident enough, skilled enough to execute a weapons-free apprehension at all times. Weapons are huge responsibilities, liabilities, and potential lawsuits waiting to happen.
Author:  infamousenforcer45 [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 12:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
I also carry a Taurus but mine is a pt145 pro which is more of a concealable weapon.But my favorite which stays at home is a Kimber.But I am thinking of soon purchasing a Taurus 1911.They are sweet!But RWB how do you like the LCP I was checking one out and reading alot of reviews.
Author:  SpanielPI [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 12:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
Why carry a 1911 ? They're big, bulky, heavy, and only carry what ? 8-9 rds ? For really serious, heavy duty tactical situations I have a Glock 21c with 4-28 rd mags for it loaded with 230 grn jhp's. That weapon is a beast, to say the least. It's big, bulky, totally unconcealable. It is strictly a "drop leg" tactical rig used on extremely rare occasions.

If you're wanting a full sized tactical .45, then go with the Taurus OSS model. Just fyi, the 12 rd oss mags will fit the smaller, Pro Millenium .45.

You can also attach "add ons" such as lasers, lights, etc. with the Tactical OSS.

Here are some related links:

http://www.gunblast.com/Taurus-OSS45.htm

http://www.taurustactical.com/products/ ... OSS&page=2
Author:  infamousenforcer45 [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 12:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
OH the 1911 isn't for carry just collection.
Author:  SpanielPI [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 13:01 ]
Post subject:  Ruger LCP .380
Well to my understanding production of the revamped ones starting with the new serial number prefix of 371 has temporarily ceased. Whatever models that are still available are pre-lawsuit distributed.

As I understand the situation, and this is unconfirmed, Kel-tec allowed the patent/copyrights to their .380 to expire. Ruger immediately siezed that opportunity and refiled under their product name "Ruger LCP .380" with 1 modification. The Rugers have a standard slide lock, which the Kel-tecs do not.

Kel-tec immediately filed a lawsuit against Ruger, and requested an injunction against them temporarily preventing them from producing any more until the suit is settled in court. The injunction was granted, thus niether company can lawfully manufacture these weapons at this time.

So, as with anything else, the law of supply and demand has kicked in. In my area, the Kel-tecs were going for around $200.00 or so; The Rugers around $280 on up. Since the lawsuit, the kel-tecs have gone to $300 and the Rugers anywhere from $350 - on up.

So my advice to you and anyone else who is interested, if you can find one, NIB at a fair price, BUY IT and put it away. It may soon become a collector's item.

1 other thing to be aware of: Check the SN prefix on the Rugers: If they start with 370...they are currently under factory recall; If they start with 371...they are the revamped model.
Author:  global [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 15:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
Where did you get your training? The purpose of shooting someone is to KILL them? Tell that to a lawyer on the stand if you ever have to use deadly force. I promise you will be miserable for some years to come. The purpose of shooting someone is not to KILL them. The purpose of shooting someone is to STOP THE THREAT directed at you or a third person. If the perp dies, then the perp dies. You shoot to stop a threat, not to KILL anyone, JESSE JAMES !

For the record, I carry a Glock 21 in .45 cal. This is the most tested and proven handgun rounds in production ever and it has above average stopping power without playing DIRTY HARRY. I have pulled my weapon many times and pointed it at perps multiple times. I pray to the good Lord above that I never have to pull the trigger in defense. Look how many people this would effect. How many small kids did the perp have. The use of deadly force don't just save your life. It ruins the lives of many people. Some you will never get to meet, including the perps.

So if your purpose or mission in life is to shoot-to-kill, may I suggest a 2.00 cap gun with a .10 cork in it. Also, may I suggest you get another career and don't ask me to clear a house or search a building with you.

Sorry if I P_ _ _ _ D anybody off with my response. I usually am just quiet and read. This could not go without my intervention, though. That is one stupid remark.
Author:  SpanielPI [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 17:37 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
Obviously you missed this part:

Quote:
But again, please bear in mind: It is not our function to cause injury or death to anyone. Rather it is our responsibility and mission to safely and legally exonerate our client's liability and bond as low key, quietly, and non-threatening a manner as possible.

We have to be trained enough, confident enough, skilled enough to execute a weapons-free apprehension at all times. Weapons are huge responsibilities, liabilities, and potential lawsuits waiting to happen.

Well, that's the beauty of this country, everyone has a right to thier own opinion. To answer your question, I initially recieved my combat training from the U.S. Army where they did teach us to "shoot to kill". Which by the way, killing the enemy, perp, aggressor, actor, etc. also "stops the threat".

I have also been taught, repeatedly, that only wounding an individual also leads to lawsuits, possible criminal charges etc.

The best scenario of all is to never even have to draw a weapon at all, much less use one. But I have ALSO been taught from day one, you never draw or aim your weapon unless you intend to use it...PERIOD.

I also believe that if you have read any of my posts at all, you will see that I consistently teach and preach non-violent, low impact, low profile, professional apprehensions. I think you totally misunderstood or misread my post. No sane person wants to actually kill anyone....but it is a doctrine that is taught if you HAVE TO SHOOT, YOU SHOOT TO KILL....PERIOD.

I also have to question your comment regarding your actions RAMBO of drawing your weapon to force compliance with your orders or apprehension. Too many chances of it being taken away from you, accidental discharge- Glocks do not have standard safety features...all it takes is a little bit of pressure on the trigger and they will fire. What if a defendant grabs your gun and it goes off ? So please tell me Mr. Rambo who's being more careless here ?

How about the chances you are taking of being criminally charged with menacing, felony aggravated assault, terroristic threats, brandishing, and all the other potential crimes you are breaking when you draw your weapon ? YOU explain to a Da why you were so scared that you felt the need to draw a Glock 21 .45 calibre handgun on a defendant.

If you are that scared that you have to draw your weapon during your apprehensions, then it seems to me that you are the one who needs to find a new job. I rarely have ever drawn my weapon on a defendant, and the few times I have, I did so for my safety and that of my team's because I felt threatened.

Where did you get your training from ?
Quote:
The purpose of shooting someone is not to KILL them.
I agree that is one stupid remark. Anyone who has ever undergone Military or Police training is taught the "shoot to kill" doctrine when faced with a kill or be killed scenario.

No worries regarding us ever working together....by your own admission, you are a walking lawsuit waiting to happen..... :lol:
Author:  speezack [ Fri 24 Apr 2009 18:54 ]
Post subject:  Re: 9's or 45"s???
Well, here goes.........

... if I pull my gun it's because I fear for my life and the threat, believed to be deadly will be met with equally deadly force... and I aim for "center mass"... that ain't a wounding area.... if I only want to hurt or wound someone... I will just tell them a bad joke 8) .......... but if I pull my gun on you .... you are in a heap of trouble.... and as for the law suit.... what's that old adage.... "rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6..." I want to be the one in court explaining why I killed him rather than the other way around.....

.... actually, if I ever feel that I have the need to use a weapon in the course of a pickup.... I most often have several of my 'bad azz' buddies with me and they do the deal... I ain't John Wayne but I have several friends that are... :lol: 8) 8) but even old and feeble as I am... I can still double tap a pack of smokes at 10' and that's all I need.... BTW... my carry is a little XD.40 sub-compact Springfield... I can't afford a Glock.
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